Gm Engineering sucks A$$
09-01-2004, 11:41 PM
#1
2000 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,417
I have a 2003 Cav Z24, winter time wife smokes a curb buckles the tire under abit gets it all fixed about 2 weeks later we hear a rubbing noise on left turns, take it back dealership says " strut " needed to be replaced get it back tire still rubs not as easy but now when you turn left with people in the car or on a downhill causing body roll. We take it back to the dealership they take the front right side apart measure everything "everything is fine", we took a brand new car and measurments came out correct" ok then still doesn't make sense it never did this before, why doesn't the right tire do this " Uhh I dunno that's a good question ". I tell them not acceptable I want it fixed 2 hours later I get a call back car is done and there's nothign more then can do about it, Gm tech line states it's a known issue due to the bigger tires *Z24 gets 205/50/R16, lower models get like a 195/60/R15 or something*, Gm never took into consideration of the bigger tires that if they do rub they should put some form of a stopper so the tired doesn't rub on the inner wheel well.
I called Gm's so called "Customer Satisfaction Line " stated my complaint/issue lady says she can look into it and get back to me she hasn't heard of the issue but will let me know. Couple days have gone by I get a call " yes Gm tech line stated this is known issue, but unfortunately I can't do anything for you all I can do is close the case as dissatisfied customer" I ask the lady what do does that do for me, I spent about 30,000$ on the car with extra warranty/paint protection etc etc, and there's nothing you can do about it, I want to know how to speak to someone hire up, "Oh you can't do that", so I stated my other means then would be with Better Buisness Bureau then right? " I can't suggest what to do but if you took that route then yes".
After couple days goes by I file with BBB, and today I get a response back from Gm " After extensive review of ******** 2003 Cavalier Z24 will will not be able to offer anything to this customer and the file will not be re-open" So they realize this is a known issue but refuse to do anything about I would have figured since I didn't state what I want out of it, they would have offered something towards compensation of sorts nothing. So I have to file a 2nd time, if they turn it down again then my 3rd option is going for Mediation/Arbitration against Gm which the BBB offers then discussing resolution that way which I am more then willing to go. I requested the written document stating " this is known issue " but of course I get " Oh I am sorry we can't just mail that due to privacy act, we need you to mail in a request etc etc and it could take from a 1-2 months to get this information, unless someone from the BBB calls in or asks for your file specifically show Gm acknowledges this is a known issue. Which then I suppose if nothing gets done about it I could take it to the local paper if they cared enough, but it's a consumer issue that gm needs to be aware of and fix there engineering screw ups.
As far as I know, the J-body platform for these cars have been the same sine day one in 95 when they first came out, I never heard of anyone having this issue, even my 98 Sunfire Gt which has the same tires was fine no rubbing or anything doesn't make sense why in 2003 it's all of a sudden a known issue? If this had done this since day 1 I would have never bought the car and went with the 03 Tiburon I originally wanted...but the wife bought it so she had final say. For those who want to buy a 2003/2004 Cavalier/Sunfire be advised of the issue with the Z24/GT packages and you may find down the road you could be running into the same problem...
Rant over
[ September 02, 2004, 12:44 AM: Message edited by: ChizzerZ24 ]
I called Gm's so called "Customer Satisfaction Line " stated my complaint/issue lady says she can look into it and get back to me she hasn't heard of the issue but will let me know. Couple days have gone by I get a call " yes Gm tech line stated this is known issue, but unfortunately I can't do anything for you all I can do is close the case as dissatisfied customer" I ask the lady what do does that do for me, I spent about 30,000$ on the car with extra warranty/paint protection etc etc, and there's nothing you can do about it, I want to know how to speak to someone hire up, "Oh you can't do that", so I stated my other means then would be with Better Buisness Bureau then right? " I can't suggest what to do but if you took that route then yes".
After couple days goes by I file with BBB, and today I get a response back from Gm " After extensive review of ******** 2003 Cavalier Z24 will will not be able to offer anything to this customer and the file will not be re-open" So they realize this is a known issue but refuse to do anything about I would have figured since I didn't state what I want out of it, they would have offered something towards compensation of sorts nothing. So I have to file a 2nd time, if they turn it down again then my 3rd option is going for Mediation/Arbitration against Gm which the BBB offers then discussing resolution that way which I am more then willing to go. I requested the written document stating " this is known issue " but of course I get " Oh I am sorry we can't just mail that due to privacy act, we need you to mail in a request etc etc and it could take from a 1-2 months to get this information, unless someone from the BBB calls in or asks for your file specifically show Gm acknowledges this is a known issue. Which then I suppose if nothing gets done about it I could take it to the local paper if they cared enough, but it's a consumer issue that gm needs to be aware of and fix there engineering screw ups.
As far as I know, the J-body platform for these cars have been the same sine day one in 95 when they first came out, I never heard of anyone having this issue, even my 98 Sunfire Gt which has the same tires was fine no rubbing or anything doesn't make sense why in 2003 it's all of a sudden a known issue? If this had done this since day 1 I would have never bought the car and went with the 03 Tiburon I originally wanted...but the wife bought it so she had final say. For those who want to buy a 2003/2004 Cavalier/Sunfire be advised of the issue with the Z24/GT packages and you may find down the road you could be running into the same problem...
Rant over
[ September 02, 2004, 12:44 AM: Message edited by: ChizzerZ24 ]
09-02-2004, 05:42 AM
#3
500 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 648
Have you got a second independent opinion???
Ihave used these guys in the past to help with desputes
http://www.apa.ca/template.asp?lang=english
Ihave used these guys in the past to help with desputes
http://www.apa.ca/template.asp?lang=english
09-02-2004, 09:45 AM
#5
500 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 575
Originally posted by Hardwrkr:
I have a 2000 Sunfire GT. I replaced the factory 205/50/16 tires with 225/45/16.
These are a good deal wider and with the extra width they should be around the same height and I have no rubbing whatsoever.
I have a 2000 Sunfire GT. I replaced the factory 205/50/16 tires with 225/45/16.
These are a good deal wider and with the extra width they should be around the same height and I have no rubbing whatsoever.
Tire height (in mm) = 2*(width*aspect) + 25.4*diameter
H1 = 2*(205*0.5) + 25.4*16
H1 = 611.4 mm
H2 = 2*225*0.45 + 25.4*16
H2 = 608.9 mm
H1 is taller than H2 by 2.5 mm
[ September 02, 2004, 10:46 AM: Message edited by: Jmac ]
09-02-2004, 11:11 AM
#6
2000 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,417
It's not so much a 2nd opinion I need, Gm already stated it was there screw up and like you said Hardwrkr I know people with wider tires as well and no issues at all with it. That's why I find it hard to believe it's a known issue, cause all the vehicles should be doing it then... I will wait out the BBB process see if anything comes to it then if not I will contact the Ontario Motor and Vehicle Council and see what happens from there.
[ September 02, 2004, 12:11 PM: Message edited by: ChizzerZ24 ]
[ September 02, 2004, 12:11 PM: Message edited by: ChizzerZ24 ]
09-02-2004, 11:33 AM
#8
500 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 604
If your wife hit a curb then there is nothing they will do about it. Period. Even though if that is not the intial cause of it they will just blame it on you anyways.
Take for example if you get into a car accident. Some guy runs a red and T-bones you. Clearly his fault. You break your arm. They guy would have to pay for you physo and lost wages ect. Now if you weren't wearing your seatbelt. You would assume all the costs of everything and the guy would get off scott free. Even though if he never hit you it never would have happen in the first place.
It is a scape goat. The best thing that you can do it keep at you complaint and hope they get tired of you and just fix it.
[ September 02, 2004, 12:37 PM: Message edited by: D-50Truck ]
Take for example if you get into a car accident. Some guy runs a red and T-bones you. Clearly his fault. You break your arm. They guy would have to pay for you physo and lost wages ect. Now if you weren't wearing your seatbelt. You would assume all the costs of everything and the guy would get off scott free. Even though if he never hit you it never would have happen in the first place.
It is a scape goat. The best thing that you can do it keep at you complaint and hope they get tired of you and just fix it.
[ September 02, 2004, 12:37 PM: Message edited by: D-50Truck ]
09-02-2004, 11:37 AM
#9
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,494
Maybe your inner fender some how got moved when you hit the curb? GM did do what they could, if its a known problem, then its a simple call back, that they cant really do about.. Oh well just your luck.
Oh the paper wont do anything, it will just stick out saying 1 car did this.
Oh this is the first time I have ever head this... And its also a cavi.. Just buy new tires.
-db
[ September 02, 2004, 12:38 PM: Message edited by: soLoRed ]
Oh the paper wont do anything, it will just stick out saying 1 car did this.
Oh this is the first time I have ever head this... And its also a cavi.. Just buy new tires.
-db
[ September 02, 2004, 12:38 PM: Message edited by: soLoRed ]
09-02-2004, 11:58 AM
#10
2000 Watt CAFz'r
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Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,417
Originally posted by D-50Truck:
If your wife hit a curb then there is nothing they will do about it. Period. Even though if that is not the intial cause of it they will just blame it on you anyways.
Take for example if you get into a car accident. Some guy runs a red and T-bones you. Clearly his fault. You break your arm. They guy would have to pay for you physo and lost wages ect. Now if you weren't wearing your seatbelt. You would assume all the costs of everything and the guy would get off scott free. Even though if he never hit you it never would have happen in the first place.
It is a scape goat. The best thing that you can do it keep at you complaint and hope they get tired of you and just fix it.
If your wife hit a curb then there is nothing they will do about it. Period. Even though if that is not the intial cause of it they will just blame it on you anyways.
Take for example if you get into a car accident. Some guy runs a red and T-bones you. Clearly his fault. You break your arm. They guy would have to pay for you physo and lost wages ect. Now if you weren't wearing your seatbelt. You would assume all the costs of everything and the guy would get off scott free. Even though if he never hit you it never would have happen in the first place.
It is a scape goat. The best thing that you can do it keep at you complaint and hope they get tired of you and just fix it.
