power wire gauge q.
04-01-2005, 03:59 AM
#11
Guys for the most part copper wire is copper wire.... saying different is wack.. [img]graemlins/freak.gif[/img]
hey limo, if you expect more then 800wrms a piece out of those amps your are going to have to run them under 2ohms/channel....
hey limo, if you expect more then 800wrms a piece out of those amps your are going to have to run them under 2ohms/channel....
04-01-2005, 06:59 PM
#12
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 67
Originally posted by slow/n\low:
DIDDO!! I wont even get into an argument with an internet commando.
If they did some research they would find out how silly those comments are. By research I dont mean what your buddy or internet friend says!!. People on forums are funny. They are so cheap that because they cant afford things they try to justify it to themselves as just as good.
DIDDO!! I wont even get into an argument with an internet commando.
If they did some research they would find out how silly those comments are. By research I dont mean what your buddy or internet friend says!!. People on forums are funny. They are so cheap that because they cant afford things they try to justify it to themselves as just as good.
I've spoken to two different electrical engineers about this before coming to my conclusion. One had about 5 years experience, and one had about 25 years. The latter also specializes in power amplifier design, and has built audio amplifiers in the past (strictly as a hobby).
But maybe they're wrong. I say that because I can tell that we are in the presence of genius here, in the form of slow/n\low. If this is the case, however, it would really be useful for me and others to hear some reasoning or explanation that is a little more thorough than "DIDDO!!!!!@#@#!"
04-02-2005, 02:31 PM
#13
2000 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,026
^^ I have had similar conversations with engineering students on campus. They agree that copper is copper. As for this comment:
Think about this. A welder replaces his cable ever few years because it doesn't stay in one place. He is constantly moving around, welding from different angles etc. All of this movement gradually breaks down both the copper and the housing of the wire. The less movement, the slower the break-down. If you are mounting it in your car, how much moving around will their be? That is why the wire needs replacing.
The principle of your argument is irrational. By using the logic of your argument, I have come to this conclusion.
"Since, I do not need to replace all housedhold wiring every 2 years, then Standard 14/2 household wire would be great for car audio wiring."
This is not the case. The wiring doesn't need to be replaced beause it isn't being twisted and bent. I would like to see some real evidence other than replacement time.
Originally posted by loudtdi:
lol....
Do a search on welding cable vs actual car audio cable....there was a good thread going a couple of weeks ago.
Welding cable is good for welding....it is cheap and gets the job done for that application.
I would guess a welder that is busy replaces those cables every couple of years......you dont want to do that in your car.
lol....
Do a search on welding cable vs actual car audio cable....there was a good thread going a couple of weeks ago.
Welding cable is good for welding....it is cheap and gets the job done for that application.
I would guess a welder that is busy replaces those cables every couple of years......you dont want to do that in your car.
The principle of your argument is irrational. By using the logic of your argument, I have come to this conclusion.
"Since, I do not need to replace all housedhold wiring every 2 years, then Standard 14/2 household wire would be great for car audio wiring."
This is not the case. The wiring doesn't need to be replaced beause it isn't being twisted and bent. I would like to see some real evidence other than replacement time.
04-02-2005, 05:39 PM
#15
I have seen many installs with welding cable.
The installs that were 2 or 3 years old had the jacket of the cable breaking down, it gets very brittle and cracks once it starts to break down. Any permeation of the jacket will allow air to do its thing. (oxidization).
The flexability is not as good as half decent car audio cable. I am not an installer but have done a few installs. It is nicer to work with more flexible cable.
Many car audio specific cables currently have the individual conductors tinned instead of bare copper. This will greatly reduce the chance of oxidization at your connections.
Dont get me wrong, welding cable will work, meaning it will transfer the current. The current flow will begin to be compromised as the jacket breaks down and the connections start to corrode.
Summarized, The jacket is not ideal for under hood conditions and the conductors are not tinned. You will have to take extra precaution at the termination points and protect the jacket under hood with some split loom. You will have to deal with the decreased flexability.
Comments appreciated.
Kevin
The installs that were 2 or 3 years old had the jacket of the cable breaking down, it gets very brittle and cracks once it starts to break down. Any permeation of the jacket will allow air to do its thing. (oxidization).
The flexability is not as good as half decent car audio cable. I am not an installer but have done a few installs. It is nicer to work with more flexible cable.
Many car audio specific cables currently have the individual conductors tinned instead of bare copper. This will greatly reduce the chance of oxidization at your connections.
Dont get me wrong, welding cable will work, meaning it will transfer the current. The current flow will begin to be compromised as the jacket breaks down and the connections start to corrode.
Summarized, The jacket is not ideal for under hood conditions and the conductors are not tinned. You will have to take extra precaution at the termination points and protect the jacket under hood with some split loom. You will have to deal with the decreased flexability.
Comments appreciated.
Kevin
04-02-2005, 06:36 PM
#16
Guest
Posts: n/a
so if someone was to cold weld and solder the connections(which should be done anyway to would eliminate undesirable corrosion) and solder, and cover with loom under the hood(which should be done as well), the jacket wouldnt break down and its ability to transfer current as well as car audio cable, the only drawback "might" be flexibility, and im sure that you would agree that there is some very unflexable car audio cable(1/0 awg)
04-03-2005, 09:01 AM
#18
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 68
Although I ran audio power wire in my car, personally, I don't feel as though it would be a poor decision to run welding cable.
Being an elevator mechanic, I have seen hundreds of 50 year old elevators still utilizing the original traveling cables.
Traveling cables run from the elevator machine room (top of the building)down the hoistway (beside the elevator)loop under the elevator, and into the bottom of the cab. It is the wires within the traveling cable that provide all electricity inside the cab, and to send signals back to the controller when passengers push car call buttons.
These cables curl and move all the time....as the elevator rises the loop of the traveling cable rises beneath the cab.
My experience tells me that more of a concern to car audio enthusiasts should be the tightness of connections at the amp and battery as opposed to the type of conductor. Over time, the heating and cooling of the conductor will cause the wire diameter to expand and contract...this will have an effect on the connections. My thoughts are to treat the connections like a regular maintenance item...put a screwdriver, or allen key on the connections once a year and give them a tighten.
Being an elevator mechanic, I have seen hundreds of 50 year old elevators still utilizing the original traveling cables.
Traveling cables run from the elevator machine room (top of the building)down the hoistway (beside the elevator)loop under the elevator, and into the bottom of the cab. It is the wires within the traveling cable that provide all electricity inside the cab, and to send signals back to the controller when passengers push car call buttons.
These cables curl and move all the time....as the elevator rises the loop of the traveling cable rises beneath the cab.
My experience tells me that more of a concern to car audio enthusiasts should be the tightness of connections at the amp and battery as opposed to the type of conductor. Over time, the heating and cooling of the conductor will cause the wire diameter to expand and contract...this will have an effect on the connections. My thoughts are to treat the connections like a regular maintenance item...put a screwdriver, or allen key on the connections once a year and give them a tighten.
04-04-2005, 12:03 AM
#20
This is Hilarious.
Being a Welder and avid Car audio enthousist, I choose a decent 1/0 welding cable.
Welding with 200 amps of current for hours on end each day we seldomly replace the cable.
Even then we only hack off 6" off the end cause thats were it starts to corrode due to over heating.
I wanna know where this dry and cracking and falling apart cable came from. LMAO.
Also, why is it that one time when I found some 4 ga Pheonix Gold OFC BLAH BLAH cable in an old car it was stiff as hell and corroded to shat?
Use the welding cable.
BTW you can find decent 1/0 welding cable for less then 1.50$ per foot.
X
Being a Welder and avid Car audio enthousist, I choose a decent 1/0 welding cable.
Welding with 200 amps of current for hours on end each day we seldomly replace the cable.
Even then we only hack off 6" off the end cause thats were it starts to corrode due to over heating.
I wanna know where this dry and cracking and falling apart cable came from. LMAO.
Also, why is it that one time when I found some 4 ga Pheonix Gold OFC BLAH BLAH cable in an old car it was stiff as hell and corroded to shat?
Use the welding cable.
BTW you can find decent 1/0 welding cable for less then 1.50$ per foot.
X
