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Ask Me Anything About Audio System Design
12-01-2010, 07:29 PM
#341
Goalie Man
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 1,412
my next thing to due is the wish list.... what do i want, so i always start with speakers as they are the only thing you hear so i put most of my money into that... think about it. do you listn to the deck.. no its the speakers.. then my deck, now do i want mp3, bluetooth, high voltage, no power, copper chassis, 4 pre outs, three, sub out, ect.ect ect.. next is amps, do i want one amp per speaker, per pair, or per side.. ie all mono blocks, all two channels or four channels and mono blocks. then its processors and dynamat last..
12-01-2010, 07:40 PM
#342
Goalie Man
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 1,412
ok now we have an idea of car, and a list of gear as follows... (these have no bearing on reality, just for the purpose of this thread.)
car of choice is a dodge sx2.0 2005 $4000.00 in good shape.
speakers( i have decided on a 4 way set up)
a.) tweets :tang band 25-1414 $100 buck a pair
mid range :dayton audio rs-52 $125 a pair
mid bass : peerless 830883 $150 a pair
subs : mtx 7512 times 2. $500 for a pair.
b.) deck- stock as it does all i need and no theft, that paramount to me.. but i want to run my ipod..... so check out my processor. as far as sq goes a stock deck in a car will sound ,to a human ear, no different than my dex-p99rs... now every computer can "see" a difference but as andy weyhmyers with jbl states, its the car that makes the most difference and install.. please refer to diyma.com under jbl ms-8 thread last page.. if you want a better deck thats your choice, but for this discussion there is no way iam going to pick one deck over another, especially since it wont affect sq, its purley subjective to each owner.
car of choice is a dodge sx2.0 2005 $4000.00 in good shape.
speakers( i have decided on a 4 way set up)
a.) tweets :tang band 25-1414 $100 buck a pair
mid range :dayton audio rs-52 $125 a pair
mid bass : peerless 830883 $150 a pair
subs : mtx 7512 times 2. $500 for a pair.
b.) deck- stock as it does all i need and no theft, that paramount to me.. but i want to run my ipod..... so check out my processor. as far as sq goes a stock deck in a car will sound ,to a human ear, no different than my dex-p99rs... now every computer can "see" a difference but as andy weyhmyers with jbl states, its the car that makes the most difference and install.. please refer to diyma.com under jbl ms-8 thread last page.. if you want a better deck thats your choice, but for this discussion there is no way iam going to pick one deck over another, especially since it wont affect sq, its purley subjective to each owner.
12-01-2010, 07:50 PM
#343
Goalie Man
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 1,412
now for the amps. remember any amp can go here not these so please adjust to your linking and budget..
1.) two four channel pioneer prs-a900 $3200.00 pair
2.) one mtx elite te1501d.. $800.00
last is the processor and dynamat. i have chosen the jbl ms-8 $899.99 and 4 cases of dynamat and 4 cases of dynamat extreme $1500.00.
now i want a bigger better power delivery system.. so i will take a look at how much i can get in the car and the cost... so i run down to princess auto and pick up 40 feet of zero power wire at 2.50 per foot 20 feet of 4 awg. 1.50 ft. then off to wal-mart pic up a okptima yellow top group 35, thats the biggest that will fit $250.00 and then the biggest alt. that will fit my car in my budget is 200 amps internal regulator from teamshadowspl $500 buck.. now for my battery terminals fuses and ends i go to my local stereo expert shop and pick up all the jewlery for around $400 bucks.. whew.. lots of boxes in my living room. to bad they are just collecting dust.. but not for long,.
1.) two four channel pioneer prs-a900 $3200.00 pair
2.) one mtx elite te1501d.. $800.00
last is the processor and dynamat. i have chosen the jbl ms-8 $899.99 and 4 cases of dynamat and 4 cases of dynamat extreme $1500.00.
now i want a bigger better power delivery system.. so i will take a look at how much i can get in the car and the cost... so i run down to princess auto and pick up 40 feet of zero power wire at 2.50 per foot 20 feet of 4 awg. 1.50 ft. then off to wal-mart pic up a okptima yellow top group 35, thats the biggest that will fit $250.00 and then the biggest alt. that will fit my car in my budget is 200 amps internal regulator from teamshadowspl $500 buck.. now for my battery terminals fuses and ends i go to my local stereo expert shop and pick up all the jewlery for around $400 bucks.. whew.. lots of boxes in my living room. to bad they are just collecting dust.. but not for long,.
Last edited by goalie 35; 12-01-2010 at 07:59 PM.
12-01-2010, 08:46 PM
#344
50 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 230
as you can see by the replys on your last post, not one word of what you said will improve the sq of my car..almost everyone on this board will agree that amps dont make enough of a sonic difference to put that much effort into which amp will make my car sound better.. class of amps, color, power features... really are not whats going to make or break your sq system... nor is deck design or wire choice so please dont elaborate on those issues either.. if you run good quality amps.. a decent head unit, and top notch speakers working in there normal operating range, you will have a good sounding system... now this thread is about sq so lets get some tips on getting better sq..
first things first.. after you have made the decision to go into the sq world, its time to pick a vehicle... now this really is a matter of taste as everything can sound awsome, just depends on how much work, time, money and whats the car for, just car shows or daily driver, will all make your decision for you.
... so lets say a daily driver, need back seats but can sacrifice trunk, have all winter to build and a shop, and want to drop good money.. have no problems rebuilding dash, dont want to use doors for speakers, will dynamat and do the big three....
some good cars are dodge,sx 2.0 , honda civic, honda fit, mazda 3, . all get good gas mileage, reliable, well built, and easy to disassemble and reassemble..
first things first.. after you have made the decision to go into the sq world, its time to pick a vehicle... now this really is a matter of taste as everything can sound awsome, just depends on how much work, time, money and whats the car for, just car shows or daily driver, will all make your decision for you.
... so lets say a daily driver, need back seats but can sacrifice trunk, have all winter to build and a shop, and want to drop good money.. have no problems rebuilding dash, dont want to use doors for speakers, will dynamat and do the big three....
some good cars are dodge,sx 2.0 , honda civic, honda fit, mazda 3, . all get good gas mileage, reliable, well built, and easy to disassemble and reassemble..
If you perceive a different path please open your own thread and stop Hi-jacking mine please...
Thank you.
PS they are quiet because they are listen and learning... And they are respecting my request to hold off on the questions for a little while... When you're done teaching I will start again...
Last edited by dogbaker; 12-01-2010 at 08:50 PM.
12-02-2010, 12:29 AM
#345
0 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 22
Hi Goalie this is my Thread Friend!
If you perceive a different path please open your own thread and stop Hi-jacking mine please...
Thank you.
PS they are quiet because they are listen and learning... And they are respecting my request to hold off on the questions for a little while... When you're done teaching I will start again...
If you perceive a different path please open your own thread and stop Hi-jacking mine please...
Thank you.
PS they are quiet because they are listen and learning... And they are respecting my request to hold off on the questions for a little while... When you're done teaching I will start again...
12-02-2010, 01:33 AM
#346
Goalie Man
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 1,412
ya my bad iam sorry about that.. iam not very computer savey so not good with alot of etiquet.. and again what the hell does amp design have to due with sq? really all amps sound almost exactly the same. every engineer knows this why would you tell us how they are built? ok great i now know the difference between class a vs class b, but my car still sounds like poo....so you havent really helped me.. see my point... give us meat and potatoes... or change your topic to electrical design and topology layouts 101. by the way my next post was going to be... after you get all the gear in your new dodge drive over to dogbakers house and have him install it... lol...sorry again...and yes iam reading your posts and absorbing your knowledge..
Last edited by goalie 35; 12-02-2010 at 01:36 AM.
12-02-2010, 01:48 AM
#347
50 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 230
ya my bad iam sorry about that.. iam not very computer savey so not good with alot of etiquet.. and again what the hell does amp design have to due with sq? really all amps sound almost exactly the same. every engineer knows this why would you tell us how they are built? ok great i now know the difference between class a vs class b, but my car still sounds like poo....so you havent really helped me.. see my point... give us meat and potatoes... or change your topic to electrical design and topology layouts 101. by the way my next post was going to be... after you get all the gear in your new dodge drive over to dogbakers house and have him install it... lol...sorry again...and yes iam reading your posts and absorbing your knowledge..
If you want to get to the next level, you're going to have to leave many rules of thumb behind and learn about true design...
When I was learning about such things, I remember thinking a lot like you do; however, those days have come and gone and my knowledge has move far-far along...
So before I breakout into full song I am just going to tell to suck my D**G!
Just Kidding, your posts are most likely useful to many, but i was simply saying that this wasn't the thread for you to make them - Nothing more.
PS After 1100 plus post, you call yourself new???
Last edited by dogbaker; 12-02-2010 at 10:52 AM.
12-02-2010, 05:47 AM
#348
Yankee
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,599
so what have you learned? there has been very few facts in this thread and a lot of opinion, nothing to change the way most would design or build a car audio system. We have had hundreds of threads with actual technical content, this has not had much 'how to do it'. This thread has dealt with philosophy or concepts of design and not to any real level of construction.
The only consistent is dogbaker being somewhat arrogant which is entertaining as well.
The only consistent is dogbaker being somewhat arrogant which is entertaining as well.
12-02-2010, 06:25 AM
#349
I say unless we get "actual technical content" & some proven, repeatable facts... this thread would do MUCH BETTER in the BEEF SECTION. 
We need John Myers in this "SQ" thread...
We need John Myers in this "SQ" thread...
Last edited by DeadlySones; 12-02-2010 at 07:00 AM.
12-02-2010, 10:22 AM
#350
50 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 230
I have provided citations for virtually all that I have posted JohnV.
Not one person that has refuted my posts has done the same. Now that’s a fact!
As for useful data - be patient, a complete picture will be provided over time - no short cuts... one step at a time, if all the fighting stops, we could be further along (think about it)!
If you want to know what R13 has learned, simply re-read every post in here and assume that he didn't know 10% and therefore his knowledge increased by 10% - that's a big gain especially when you consider that I am only approximately 10% of the way through, with what I intend to share.
JohnV, you are not a professional you are a consumer hobbyist - you couldn't even get an interview in my world - so stop making unqualified, inflammatory comments in this one!
I've said before and I'll say it again, stop miss-quoting me, read what I have written carefully and at least twice, then if you aren’t sure that I am on the mark, take my citations and investigate them and you will discover that I am on point (and at the very minimum, you will in fact learn something new – which is my ultimate goal). And finally, if you aren't interested or don't perceive a value in here, then move on and open your own thread and offer everyone the truth as you see it. In this way, everyone will get along and become satisfied.
There are no short cuts in taking things to the highest levels in fidelity, so therefore, there are no silver bullet tips that apply universally - if there was, this forum would already contain them and we would be talking about other things like how we wish there was more to audio, because all of our systems are perfect and sound the same - click, did the light go on yet?
So as with all things - self or accredited education is the only path to enlightenment and rules of thumb are general summary truths that keep our paths lit while on the way! They’re useful, but they are not the goal.
As well, if you feel like fighting - simply don't!
If you feel like answering someone’s question (that is addressed to me) don't!
If you feel the need to educate me, don't!
This is a teaching thread – one in which I am offering answers, I have not posted any questions to aliased answers from the masses, but I have invited all to ask me questions about high fidelity system design and have cautioned that the answers will be in-depth (as practical)(also as I don't have time to answer every question, I have decieded to teach the fundementals, so that people can learn to teach themselves). If you believe that you know more than I do about the subject, open your own teaching thread and unlike you (and others) I will show you the proper respect you deserve and I will not comment against you within your own forum, I would however, send you a private PM offering you some additional insight, if you refused it, I would respect that and permanently move on.
All this seems very straight-forward to me I am not sure why I keep seeing the same type of push back... (note that this is not a question, but a statement!)
Not one person that has refuted my posts has done the same. Now that’s a fact!
As for useful data - be patient, a complete picture will be provided over time - no short cuts... one step at a time, if all the fighting stops, we could be further along (think about it)!
If you want to know what R13 has learned, simply re-read every post in here and assume that he didn't know 10% and therefore his knowledge increased by 10% - that's a big gain especially when you consider that I am only approximately 10% of the way through, with what I intend to share.
JohnV, you are not a professional you are a consumer hobbyist - you couldn't even get an interview in my world - so stop making unqualified, inflammatory comments in this one!
I've said before and I'll say it again, stop miss-quoting me, read what I have written carefully and at least twice, then if you aren’t sure that I am on the mark, take my citations and investigate them and you will discover that I am on point (and at the very minimum, you will in fact learn something new – which is my ultimate goal). And finally, if you aren't interested or don't perceive a value in here, then move on and open your own thread and offer everyone the truth as you see it. In this way, everyone will get along and become satisfied.
There are no short cuts in taking things to the highest levels in fidelity, so therefore, there are no silver bullet tips that apply universally - if there was, this forum would already contain them and we would be talking about other things like how we wish there was more to audio, because all of our systems are perfect and sound the same - click, did the light go on yet?
So as with all things - self or accredited education is the only path to enlightenment and rules of thumb are general summary truths that keep our paths lit while on the way! They’re useful, but they are not the goal.
As well, if you feel like fighting - simply don't!
If you feel like answering someone’s question (that is addressed to me) don't!
If you feel the need to educate me, don't!
This is a teaching thread – one in which I am offering answers, I have not posted any questions to aliased answers from the masses, but I have invited all to ask me questions about high fidelity system design and have cautioned that the answers will be in-depth (as practical)(also as I don't have time to answer every question, I have decieded to teach the fundementals, so that people can learn to teach themselves). If you believe that you know more than I do about the subject, open your own teaching thread and unlike you (and others) I will show you the proper respect you deserve and I will not comment against you within your own forum, I would however, send you a private PM offering you some additional insight, if you refused it, I would respect that and permanently move on.
All this seems very straight-forward to me I am not sure why I keep seeing the same type of push back... (note that this is not a question, but a statement!)
Last edited by dogbaker; 12-02-2010 at 10:48 AM.
